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 Post subject: In Dev: Ranger changes
PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 8:41 am 
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SOE are getting their act sorted out in terms of using the In Concept, In Dev, In Live etc cycle across all games, so communication will be on the up again hopefully.

First up is Ranger...

http://starwarsgalaxies.station.sony.co ... hancements

Quote:
Ranger Enhancements

When Han Solo, Chewbacca, Ben Kenobi, a boy and two droids made their way from the Mos Eisley cantina to Docking Bay 94, a darkly clad figure in the shadows pointed in the direction to the same docking bay. Shortly after, 30 stormtroopers tried to stop the heroes of the rebellion from escaping!

Set in a science fiction landscape, the Ranger Profession is being seen in the light of an exciting new vision. Rangers are being migrated from a resource harvesting profession to a clandestine spy-ops themed profession. To this end, various changes are being made to the ranger skills as well as the currently prerequisite Scout profession.

Changes to the Scout Profession:

In preparing to re-envision the Ranger profession, there have been some changes made to the Scout Profession and the existing Ranger skills:


Scout skills and modifiers have been redistributed throughout the scout skill trees to reflect the needs of the new profession. In addition many of the Ranger abilities have also been moved into the Scout profession.


All Ranger skills related to "tracking" have been removed from the game.


The Foraging skill has been removed from the game since they didn't play a strong role or have strong benefits.


The Rescue skill has been removed from the game as it is no longer applicable in today's SWG.


Rangers now use Reconnaissance armor instead of Battle armor to reflect their needs to be mobile and stealthy.


The Rifleman's Cover ability and a Jedi's Force Cloak now adhere to a common rule-set that falls in line with the new hiding/stealth system introduced with the Ranger revamp.


Terrain negotiation skill modifiers have been distributed throughout the Ranger skill trees.



A New Beginning

The new vision for Rangers is a bold and exciting new move for the profession. These new Rangers are geared for stealth and combat, able to hide and conceal themselves in both urban and wilderness environments. They can set special traps and create potent new explosives and traps.

The new skill lines for Ranger will be "Hiding & Concealment", "Stealth & Subterfuge", "Anti-Personnel Devices & Traps" and "Pursuit & Countermeasures".

Let's take a closer look at the new skill set:

Hiding & Concealment

Planet specific Camouflage-Kits will remain in the game, working in conjunction with the camouflage skills in this new skill line. As one cannot walk about in urban environments wearing a twig hat to blend in, we have made a distinction between urban and wild environments for concealment purposes.

Urban environments are defined as areas where there is a certain level of structural density and anywhere that is specifically designed as a city region. Wilderness environments are every else.

Camouflage skills only concern themselves with stationary concealment. Concealed movement is available in the Stealth & Subterfuge skill tree. Concealment is always subject to detection, taking into consideration skill modifiers of the person hiding and the person seeking.

Certain actions will automatically reveal a camouflaged (hidden) Ranger (like moving about, for instance) and some actions will not be possible at all under camouflage, requiring the Ranger to first reveal themselves. As the Ranger's skill in Hiding & Concealment improves, their camouflage skills will advance as well, relaxing some of the restrictions of the lower hiding skills.

Skills:

Camouflage Self: (Camouflage Skill Mod) This skill uses a planet specific camouflage kit to conceal the ranger in a wilderness environment. Movement not allowed, however posture changes are.


Camouflage Ally: (Camouflage Skill Mod) This skill uses a planet specific camouflage kit to conceal an ally of the ranger in a wilderness environment. Movement not allowed, however posture changes are.


Conceal Device: (Camouflage Skill Mod) This skill does not require camouflage kit. It allows the ranger to hide an anti-personnel trap or motion sensor. Concealed devices are only visible by the Ranger who placed them.


Blend In: (Camouflage Skill Mod) This skill allows the ranger to disappear in a crowd of humanoids in both Urban and Wilderness environments without the use of a camouflage kit.


Various planet specific camouflage kits are granted throughout this skill tree.

Skill Modifiers:

Camouflage: This existing skill modifier determines the outcome of camouflage abilities and is used to determine how likely the Ranger is detected when an opponent uses the Detect Camouflage skill.
Burst Run Efficiency: This existing skill modifier gives the ranger a much needed boost of speed if they are uncovered at an inopportune time.

Schematics:
Holographic Environment Projector - At the Master Skill Box of the profession, a ranger is given a Holographic Environment Projector schematic. With it, the ranger can craft a device that allows them to become invisible and move about in an urban environment. This projector does not work in the wilds, as there is too much random visual noise in nature that the electronics of this device cannot anticipate sufficiently to provide an adequate optical illusion of invisibility. Crafting this item uses the Camouflage skill mod for both assembly and experimentation.

The H.E.P has a power source with a maximum capacity determined by one of the experimentation lines. The power rating essentially determines how many seconds the H.E.P functions before shutting down. Once the device is shut down, it instantly recharges the power cell. When this happens, the maximum power level is permanently reduced by a small amount. Eventually the H.E.P power cells become degraded to a point where they can no longer power the device and it must be replaced. Shutting down the device before it is completely drained will preserve more of the power capacity than if one were to allow the cells to drain completely.

The second experimentation line for this device determines the effectiveness of the H.E.P. The effectiveness of the H.E.P is compared to the effectiveness of a Chaff Flare that might be deployed around a stealthy ranger in an attempt to uncover him. More effective H.E.Ps will stand up better against Chaff Flares, but will last for shorter periods of time.

Stealth & Subterfuge

Stealth skills will facilitate concealed locomotion at a reduced movement rate (IE sneaking). Stealth attempts have a higher chance of failure if the Ranger has not been previously camouflaged. If you have not been previously camouflaged, a camouflage kit is required for being stealthy. The exception to this rule is stealth in an urban setting, which is facilitated by a Holographic Energy Projector. (See above).

During stealth, periodic checks are made that may render the ranger visible. Thus, caution must be exercised when one moves about. For instance, sneaking into a building whilst disguised as a tree (as one is, when camouflaged) would immediately expose the ranger, for example.

Various planet specific camouflage kits are granted throughout this skill tree.

Skills:
Wilderness Stealth - This skill modifier allows the ranger to move under concealment in the wild. This skill requires either the "camouflage self" skill or the use of a camouflage kit.


Urban Stealth - At the Master Skill Box, this skill modifier trains the ranger how to be stealthy while moving about urban environments whilst under the cover of a holographic environment projector. This skill requires the use of a H.E.P, which can only be activated in an area void of humanoids. The optical illusion of the H.E.P. device isn't perfect and if a human were to watch someone become "invisible" they would easily be able to detect the small visual inconsistencies the device produces.

Stealing - With this Stealth skill modifier, Rangers may attempt to steal from any humanoid that they could attack under normal circumstances. The Ranger must be camouflaged or in "stealth mode" to attempt any theft. A botched stealing attempt will, at the very least, cause the Ranger to be revealed and to lose a measure of faction, if applicable. A successful stealing attempt will net either cash or loot items. Stealing objects from an NPC does *not* modify in any way the loot/cash the NPC drops when slain under normal circumstances. PvP stealing is supported by the system, but it is limited to only specially marked "steal-able" items. Steal-able items are clearly marked and currently only take the form of special mission and/or event objects. Steal-able objects are issued to players under the similar circumstances as other PvP events/missions/quests. PvP stealing is only possible versus players that one could already attack (factional enemies for instance) under existing rules.


Various planet specific camouflage kits are granted throughout this skill tree.

Skill Modifiers:
Stealth - This modifier decreases the likeliness of being detected and increases the likeliness of successfully stealthy movement.

Anti-Personnel Devices & Traps

This skill line provides schematics and skill modifiers that allow the Ranger to set traps aimed at NPC humanoids as well as other player characters in a PvP setting. Traps can be placed on the ground and are visible to everyone (unless they are concealed using the Conceal Device skill). Traps have a limited life-span and will be removed from the game at the end of their lifespan. Also, only a limited number of traps may be placed in a given area. Traps may never be placed within city limits.

Concealed devices can be detected and disarmed with the Detect Camouflage and Disarm Device skills from the Pursuit & Countermeasures skill line.

Anti-Personnel devices are either detonated remotely, via timer or proximity trigger. Device bodies and triggers are combined in the inventory (drag & drop) to create a complete trap.

These traps are technologically advanced "smart" traps that can be programmed and shaped to deliver their payload in various ways. Once successfully triggered, a trap will deliver its payload to all attackable targets in the surrounding area. Traps can also be "shaped and targeted" at one specific person, using a Bio Signature Sample (see the Pursuit & Countermeasures line).

All trap bodies and triggers use the Anti-Personnel Traps skill modifier for both assembly and experimentation. Trap bodies have a "Power" experimentation line that determines the power of the trap effect. Triggers have an "Accuracy" experimentation line that determines the reliability of the trigger to detonate the trap.

Schematics:

Timer Trigger - detonates a device after a certain amount of time. The Ranger may adjust the length of the fuse.


Proximity Trigger - detonates a device once an attackable humanoid comes within range. Proximity triggers can be tuned with a bio-signature to target the trap against a specific individual. The ranger may adjust the trigger distance of the trigger.


Remote Detonation Trigger - At the Master Skill Box, this trigger detonates a trap from a distance using a remote control.


HX2 Mine Body - Basic explosive mine. Does 100% Kinetic Elemental Fire damage (mitigated by armor & Personal Shield Generators).


Kaminoan Dart Trap Assembly - Bio Toxin darts that are delivered as a Poison Health DOT (Damage-Over-Time).


Flash-Bang Body - Combat Slow & Stun.
Spring Loaded Caltrop Assembly - This is a very effective movement Snare.

Skill Modifiers:
Anti-Personnel Traps - determines the effectiveness of a trap, and how difficult the trap is to disarm once it has been set.


Tactical Expertise - Determines the speed at which traps can be armed/set (decreases windup).

Pursuit & Countermeasures

This line contains skills and schematics that aid the Ranger in ferreting out other Rangers as well as detecting and disarming anti-personnel devices. Detecting concealed persons/objects is determined by checking the conceal skill vs. the detect skill + a slight random factor to ensure that no conceal/detect is 100% certain.

Skills:
Detect Camouflage: Searches the area for camouflaged persons/objects.


Disarm Trap: Attempts to disarm a trap. A failed disarm attempt focuses the entire force of the trap against the disarming Ranger, multiplying the effects of the given trap.

Schematics:
Chaff Flare: At the Master Skill Box, the Ranger will receive a schematic to create a device that deposits small reactive filaments in the surrounding air in an attempt to disable any active Holographic Environment Projectors.


Tracking Beacon: Uses a Bio Signature to locate a target using Imperial tracking satellites.


Bio Sensor Probe: Used on an attackable humanoid to gain a bio signature sample - used to "shape and target" a trap, filter Motion Sensor Beacons and key Tracking Beacons to a specific humanoid.

Bio sensor samples decay within a short amount of time. The length of time that a sample is preserved within the probe is determined by the crafting process.


Motion Sensor Beacon: Set up in the world to alert the ranger of humanoid movement in an area. When used in conjunction with a bio signature sample, only the targeted humanoid will set off the beacon.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2005 9:04 am 
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So added info from Helios_SOE
Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Dyrwen wrote:
Ohmigodohmigod must read link

Edit 2: Whoa, we're Rogues now. Theft as a Ranger? Weird. The smugglers are going to be mad.


Think more "spy-ish" than "rogue-ish".

Imagine, sneaking into a place, setting a surveillance beacon (to make sure no bad guys surprise you), detecting a trap in the hallway and disarming it, slowly pushing through the door - only to see the big evil boss sitting in a chair - his back facing you... you slowly sneak over to him, reach into his pocket and swipe the secret weapon plans - undetected (and good thing too, because this guy would have taken you apart)... you easily sneak back out of the compound... only to get to the front door... you see a bright flash in the air above you, accompanied by a big *POP*- someone set off a Chaff Flare and you have been revealed!

I hope you brought you cour carbine skills....

Helios_SOE wrote:
Phenix1050 wrote:

a couple of questions/comment right off the bat

-what about current traps-- are those all moving to scout? So far, yes.


-will the burst run efficiency be made more worthwhile, right now it's underpowered Right now, it's the same, pending playtesting and balancing.


-will stealing be macroable (essentially turning you into a loot-bot) No. Think of each enemy as having, potentially, several "bags" on them. Each bag has one thing in it (you can have this one thing, if you can grasp it). As you make your attempt to steal, you are given a random bag - you reach into the bag and try to grasp what is inside. If you succeed, you get to keep the prize. If you fail... well... Anyway - in either case, the bag you stuck you digits into gets taken away forever (until the enemy is slain). Now you (or someone else) can try again with the remaining bags. Success and failure depends on the camouflage skill of the thief and the detect camouflage skill of the mark (stealing can only be attempted whilst camouflaged/stealthed).

Once an attempt has been made on every bag, that enemy can't be stolen from any more. That way, stealing is just an additional little thing you can to try and get some extra rewards for facing enemies. You won't always get something amazing, but over time it could be fairly rewarding (of course you are also spending more time not killing enemies than you are killing them, so there is some additional tradeoff aside from having to spend skill points to get the ability)


-will you guys let me buy you a round? (or a case, or a lifetime supply....)

I'll take you up on that next time you make it into Austin. hehe

Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Illrigger wrote:
Just one question for now: are the pre-reqs going to be reduced to two trees like other classes?

Currently, the plan is to bring the prerequisites into line with the other professions.

Helios_SOE wrote:
Phenix1050 wrote:

also, will our counter-camo skills be able to detect Jedi and Rifleman.
Currently, Force Cloak is considered to be a mind-trick - hence it cannot be detected by someone trained to see inconsistencies in their surroundings (such as is the case with "Detect Camouflage"). Riflemen, on the other hand, will probably be vulunerable.

and I'm very sad to see the loss of tracking. To me that was a really cool system. Even underpowered as it is, it really helped Rangers out. (though I'm glad we're losing the creature-only, go-find-my-boar-for-me-you-stupid-Ranger image that we've had. What exactly is the reason for losing the tracking ability?
It was technically unsound and it was felt that a broken ability that it didn't enhance Ranger gameplay, nor fit the Ranger vision, should be removed until (and if) a more appropriate system could be devised.

and, (sorry, lol, they questions keep coming) I assume Rangers will be getting some offensive speed/accuracy and melee/ranged defense mods (at least I would hope they would). So what's the guesstimate of those figures? Are we going to be more on line with Rifleman or Squad Leader? Will melee Rangers (who need melee speed/accuracy) be taken into account when giving Rangers new mods?
Currently, the plan is to give them combat mods. Specifics are yet to be determined. Your input is appreciated.

also, would any of you like to have my first born?

I'll pass. I'm trying to cut down - I already have one of those.

Helios_SOE wrote:
Scouts, under the new system, have all of the harvesting skills that are currently distributed between both Ranger and Scout combined.


Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Owen-Lars wrote:
I think the main draw point of the profession will be the traps. If they work well then they will combine very nicely with the other skills in our templates. Yes the visual camo is a massive pvp skill and so is the stealth trapping but im sure going to enjoy going out hunting with my news traps.
My favorite part is building a little mine field with my traps and putting various triggers on them and setting them off one by one. It's really a lot of fun! But then, I like explosions.


Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
DesktopSaki wrote:
The warfare enhancements are nice. It'll be great for PVP/GWC, I'm sure.

But for shame on assuming players don't want to continue enjoying the "wildlife" aspect of it--the connection with animals, with nature, the ability to stay in the wild for days or weeks, the ability to hide and creep around animals. For shame on removing tracking.

Lots of good moves. But just as many bad ones.
You can still do most everything you were doing with Ranger, just with the Scout profession (including Mask Scent, currently). All of the non-broken abilities/skills that were in Ranger have been moved to Scout.

Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Nikolai_Xavierov wrote:
Smuggling doesnt explicitly imply stealing. The act of smuggling is MOVING stuff illegally from place to place, or person to person.
But watch out that you don't get your cargo stolen, on the way...

Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Nemo0 wrote:
Quote:
Phenix1050 wrote:
This stealing thing is gonna be very interesting, lol.
Cloaked Rangers steal from Cloaked Jedi's camping the coal bins in the DWB, lol.

"PvP stealing is supported by the system, but it is limited to only specially marked "steal-able" items. Steal-able items are clearly marked and currently only take the form of special mission and/or event objects. Steal-able objects are issued to players under the similar circumstances as other PvP events/missions/quests. PvP stealing is only possible versus players that one could already attack (factional enemies for instance) under existing rules."

I think the PvP stealing is going to play more of a GCW role than just a cool gee whiz thing. Still sounds like it could be fun. I just wouldn't worry too much about having your weapons/loot/etc stolen. It sounds like stealing will be more of a content thing later on.
A very good guess.

Helios_SOE wrote:
Quote:
Nikoziara wrote:
Quote:
DesktopSaki wrote:

...and why are we getting theft? Shouldn't that be a smuggler thing?

Message Edited by DesktopSaki on 09-16-2005 08:43 PM

Meh....theyll complain but why should we? We can just rob them and make them complain more!
You won't be able to PvP steal from other players when the system launches. It is supported, but content hasn't been created to make us of this capability yet. If/When the content does go in, it will probably be more in the direction of the Bounty-Hunter/Jedi relationship - where someone (a smuggler, just for instance) would consent to carrying a stealable item (some illegal spice, just for instance), knowing another player will get a mission to try and come steal it from them. It's almost like a game of capture the flag (gotta write that one down!). You won't, however, be able to take anything from anyone's normal inventory.

For now, though - it's strictly a PvE ability (with the possibility of a PvP component down the line).


Helios_SOE wrote:
Here are some rules common to all types of buffs that remove you from sight (including Force Cloak):

1. Taking any offensive action reveals you instantly (currently the only exception is the Rifleman's ability Conceal Shot).
2. Interacting with some objects in the world instantly reveals you (could be switches, terminals, containers, etc)
3. Some commands cannot be executed and require you to reveal yourself before executing the command
4. All of these buffs can be "toggled off" at any time you wish to become view-able by others
5. Some non-combat actions can also reveal you (like healing for instance)
6. You are afflicted with a movement snare when you are stealthy (rooted when just camouflaged)


Blixtev wrote:
Quote:
Qui-Gonzalez wrote:
Quote:
Helios_SOE wrote:
Here are some rules common to all types of buffs that remove you from sight (including Force Cloak):

1. Taking any offensive action reveals you instantly (currently the only exception is the Rifleman's ability Conceal Shot).
2. Interacting with some objects in the world instantly reveals you (could be switches, terminals, containers, etc)
3. Some commands cannot be executed and require you to reveal yourself before executing the command
4. All of these buffs can be "toggled off" at any time you wish to become view-able by others
5. Some non-combat actions can also reveal you (like healing for instance)
6. You are afflicted with a movement snare when you are stealthy (rooted when just camouflaged)
Why weren't these rules put in place when the CU went live? There have been more people abusing cloaking abilities than most anything else of late.

Some of these rules were in place post-CU. However Helios found it better to rewrite the custom coding we did for cloak/cover done in the CU and make it a much broader system. Post CU we did see many uses of cloak that were never intended when it was implemented. This seemed an opportune time to clean it up, and Helios did a bang up job of it.

When the systems team sat down to talk about Rangers we all agreed that the current implementaion was very much in the vein of the "fantasy Ranger". Tracking, foraging, harvesting creatures, etc. The only thing that was left out were bows and arrows. We all agreed that the closest Star Wars had to Ranger was the Antarian Ranger, which is more of the Stealthy, Demolitions, Spy-ish type of character.


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