Avian Gamers Network http://www.avian-gamers.net/forums/ |
|
Eve Status http://www.avian-gamers.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=75&t=19962 |
Page 1 of 2 |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Eve Status |
SO who is all playing EVE? myself and a couple of friends are considering jumping in-game so was wondering who was still active and playing? Also random question but is their any downside in reactivating a trial account from 3 years ago (at least) or would I be better off starting fresh / using the buddy program? |
Author: | Aranarth [ Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:17 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
I am still playing Aravorn is in a small up and coming Fac War Corp for the FDU (Gallente) Mathusela is in Conflagration, a corp in Widly Inappropriate and we reside in Geminate. (0.0-Gurostas Space, near Jita) I guess it all depends upon how attached you are to that trial account. If you do the buddy thing, your buddy gets a free month but that is only on new accounts. If you do get in game let me know, including your in game name. I would have a hard time getting a brand new player into either corp. It would be easier to get a low skilled player into The Fac War corp. You would probably want to focas on some basic training for the first month or two anyway before you have to start worrying about WarDecs and such. If you do play and decide to stick with it for a while, Ill send you a small stake to get you going, buying skillbooks if nothing else. A new expansion is coing out on 01 Dec, that looks like it is going to make some good improvements to the game, shaking up Sovreinghty (sp?), new Faction ships, so it looks like EVE is again reinventing itself for the better. |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:16 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Yea initially think im gonna focus on econ type stuff and training, turns out on this char I left it with lvl 4 learning skills and such so its not to shabby. Ryric Krael ign |
Author: | Aranarth [ Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:21 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Do you have both tiers of learning skills to 4? If so thats freaking awsome. So you are actually in game and playing? What region you hanging out in? What starting race are you? What are you doing for isk? Mining? Missioning? I see you are in Chicago, what time do you usually play in the evenings? (Im Eastern time in Indiana) |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:10 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Aranarth wrote: Do you have both tiers of learning skills to 4? If so thats freaking awsome. So you are actually in game and playing? What region you hanging out in? What starting race are you? What are you doing for isk? Mining? Missioning? I see you are in Chicago, what time do you usually play in the evenings? (Im Eastern time in Indiana) Both Tiers? dunno once my 72 h elapses i'll post a link to my skills using the api key. have about 900k sp An Mind, Empathy, Instant Recall, Iron Will, Learning, Spatial Awareness All are IV except Iron and Spatial are 3 Minmatar - Heimatar region (thats where some of the tutorials agents are) Mainly running tutorials atm and Mining. 2 of my RL friends joined me and are playing and so this weekend i plan to pull out my hoarder and do some mining in high sec. I tend to play between 6 - 9 on weekdays. IGN Ryric Krael as always |
Author: | Aranarth [ Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:49 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
OK sounds good At 900K SP's I would say you do not have the teir twos done. Thats a different skill that boosts the same attributes. Once you train the one that boosts intelliegnce to 4, there is second one you can also train to continue boosting intelligence. Common referred to as the "second tier training skills" Look for your wallet to flash the next time you log in. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:55 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Presents and evemail sent |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Sat Oct 24, 2009 8:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
http://eve-sheet.com/skills/Ryric_Krael As you can see I have a lot of skills with several lvl 1ers and then the skills i actually use the most at lvl 3 or 4 for the most part Electronics and Engineering are a bit messy just b/c im not quite clear on where Im going in there. Guns I have Projectile and Energy but tend to go projectile as a Minmatar Missles: Not sure on Rockets vs missles but I tend to use missles and just got FOF up to lvl 2 Industry obviously...speaks for itself, is it worth picking up the other refining skills I seem to have 90% on most refine jobs regardless of my skill. With 90% should I be refining? Leadership, just picked these up yesterday. Learning I think im missing a few either do to expense or unavailable in the area I am in. Mechanic (part of the shield vs armor) Nav: Added these today Space Command: Typical ...need to get frig and indy up to IV and III respectively. Any suggestions please let me know. Once again thank you for the seed money(i reply'd to your alt's message)...very helpful initially skill books are bloody expensive. Also any suggestions regarding my attributes would be very helpful. havn't touched them since i got back and the charisma is way out of whack. |
Author: | Ravage [ Sun Oct 25, 2009 5:12 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
know i'm coming in late on this conversation, wanted to throw my 2 cents in. I'm still playing, have my own small corp of friends, which anyone you vouch for is welcome to join if wanted. Have no rules, no expectations. just don't be a douche to other people that will give my corp any kind of negative rep. Am located in Pucherie, (gallente space) and am in close proximity to excellent agents for levels 1 through 4 missioning. even if you have no interest in joinging, send a message or start a conversation if you have any questions or want advice. name is Dark Umbra I'm willing to help get you up and running with whatever career path you have in mind, i'm quite well versed in pretty much everything from combat, to manufacturing, exploration, and ugh... even mining. ~Rav |
Author: | Aranarth [ Mon Oct 26, 2009 4:42 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ill take a look at your skills at home tonight, of course the IT fascists at work have it blocked I will say a few things however. Everyone should eventually train engineering and electronics V, sooner or later preferably sooner So if you are in doubt or need a longer skill train to end your que, you can't go wrong training these up. Most Minmatar ships are armor tankers. So I think that determines how and what you need to train in Mechanic. That will also eventually let you across over into Gallente ships quite easily. Eventually. Before I make commets about your skills further, I need to know what you see yourself doing for the next 6 months to a year to make ISK. Are you going to run missions? Are you going to mine? Do you want to manufacture? Do you see yourself staying as primarily a carebear? Is PvP something you want to get into? I have a linky somewhere I think Ill dig up. Its a good basic these are the skills every noob should train early in there career sort of thingy. Ill see if I can find it. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Mon Oct 26, 2009 4:58 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Here is the linky: http://www.kylania.com/eve/skills.php?p=core Just remember this is EVE, its just about the only "sandbox" MMO out there now a days. There is no "right answer" despite how many of the "experts", may tell you otherwise In a skills training progression you need to focas on some basic learning skills, (which I think you have done), then focas on some basic skills to make money via whatever you want to do. Then go back and get all your learning both first and second tier to level 4/4 (First teir/Second tier) Then start maxing out your support skills. Then start training up to max the different weapons skills and ships. This isn't "A HArd and Fast Rule", more of a general progression. An example maybe; You might have to get into a battlecruiser to do levels three missions. So you may have to forego training some support skills for a few days, and get Minnie Cruiser IV, then train BC's a couple of levels. When in doubt train support skills (Engineering, electronics, mechanic, navigation, etc.) because when its all said and done the vast majority of those skills will help you fly every ship you can fly. For instance and this is kind of an extreme example, shortly after I started the game I went to 0.0 with a group of relatively new pilots. The big deal was train for carriers, everybody was training for carriers. Which people started to do without even thinking about it. Then they got Racial Carrier I trained and realized they didn't have the jump skills, or they didn't have remote repair trained high enough so they could use Capitol remote repair modules. Or they didn't have Advanced Weapons upgrades trained high enough or at all, and they couldn't fit everything they wanted on the carrier. And the list goes on and on. So they spent all that training time and money on something that they were going to have to train a bunch more stuff on before they could even fly there carrier semi effectively. Where as if they had trained the support skills first every single ship they flew, they could have flown better, accelerating the grind to get and train carrier skills. (Carrier skills are ridiculously expensive) The lessen I learned from that was train those dam support skills Because they will improve every single ship youl fly one way or the other. |
Author: | Azzameen85 [ Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:45 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Aranarth wrote: ...There is no "right answer" despite how many of the "experts", may tell you otherwise ... So how many wrong answers are there? Sorry couldn't resist. But while this has been up before I gotta ask. Which race should I choose if I prefer high maneuverability with hit-n-run tactics? I played the trial some years ago but never got really into it... Though I have a friend who has 20 million ISK waiting for me. (I did him a life changing favor) |
Author: | Ravage [ Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:45 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Race doesn't matter for your character. any character can fly any ship, just determines what ship set you come out of the gate with. Minmatar have the fastest ships, if you're looking to do the hit and run type thing, they'll be your best bet.... but once you're in battleships speed is a moot point anyway. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:13 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Azzameen85 wrote: Aranarth wrote: ...There is no "right answer" despite how many of the "experts", may tell you otherwise ... So how many wrong answers are there? Sorry couldn't resist. But while this has been up before I gotta ask. Which race should I choose if I prefer high maneuverability with hit-n-run tactics? I played the trial some years ago but never got really into it... Though I have a friend who has 20 million ISK waiting for me. (I did him a life changing favor) Beadvised that hit and run is still possible but the wholes nanofag thing is pretty much ancient history now. There are lots of wrong answers just like there are lots of right answers. There are a lot of people who will tell you a Drake sucks for PvP. Im one of them because in 95% of the Drake pilots a Drake sucks in PvP. But a few with high skills, and ridiculously expensive implants can fly some pretty mean nano drakes. I ran into a pirate group in the Forge that was a master at it. I saw Drake and went lulz. Then they kicked my ass and I went "crap". So you see no right answer, no wrong answer. Its EVE Online, its a cruel hard world so Hard the f^%k up! (CCP Music Video reference ) |
Author: | Azzameen85 [ Tue Oct 27, 2009 2:10 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
I'll probably start in half a year. Again, the connection up here s**ks, so I don't wanna jump at it... But then again. Where are the EVE server placed? Iceland? If so I might have second to best connection after all, but still very expencive. EVE has always intrigued me due to the nature of play and I like to plan ahead in RPG's. I might ask questions fromt time to time from now on, while learning about the game to plan ahead what I should do and how to do it. BTW just to be clear. I am not asking you to wait for me. If no Avian players are in the game when I start, so be it. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:06 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
The last I heard there server farm was in the UK. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:36 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
I hope you dont mind I posted your skills here, so I could take a look at work, I haven't had enough time at home. Default Pilot Information Attributes for current clone (Total - Implant - Base) Charactername Ryric Krael Intelligence 19.44 - 11 Corporation Pator Tech School Perception 9.72 - 6 Total Cash Hidden Charisma 9.72 - 5 Total skill points 1,205,158 Willpower 8.64 - 5 Race / Blood line Minmatar / Sebiestor Memory 17.28 - 12 Current Training Information Training Mining Level 5 SP / Hour 1620 Time remaining 1 Days, 0 Hours, 3 Minutes and 19 Seconds ETA (eve time) about 23 hours left (11:39 am @ 29th of October, 2009)Corporation Management level2 Anchoring / Rank 3 / SP: 4,243 of 768,000 / 0.6% •1 Corporation Management skills trained, for a total of 4,243 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Drones level3 Combat Drone Operation / Rank 2 / SP: 16,000 of 512,000 / 3.1% level3 Drones / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level3 Mining Drone Operation / Rank 2 / SP: 16,000 of 512,000 / 3.1% level2 Scout Drone Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 1,415 of 256,000 / 0.6% •4 Drones skills trained, for a total of 41,415 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Electronics level3 Electronics / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level2 Electronics Upgrades / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Long Range Targeting / Rank 2 / SP: 3,356 of 512,000 / 0.7% level1 Propulsion Jamming / Rank 3 / SP: 750 of 768,000 / 0.1% level1 Targeting / Rank 1 / SP: 250 of 256,000 / 0.1% •5 Electronics skills trained, for a total of 15,185 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Engineering level1 Energy Emission Systems / Rank 2 / SP: 500 of 512,000 / 0.1% level2 Energy Grid Upgrades / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Energy Management / Rank 3 / SP: 4,243 of 768,000 / 0.6% level3 Energy Systems Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level4 Engineering / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level1 Shield Compensation / Rank 2 / SP: 500 of 512,000 / 0.1% level2 Shield Emission Systems / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Shield Management / Rank 3 / SP: 4,243 of 768,000 / 0.6% level3 Shield Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level2 Shield Upgrades / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level1 Tactical Shield Manipulation / Rank 4 / SP: 1,000 of 1,024,000 / 0.1% •11 Engineering skills trained, for a total of 80,228 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Gunnery level1 Controlled Bursts / Rank 2 / SP: 500 of 512,000 / 0.1% level4 Gunnery / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level2 Medium Projectile Turret / Rank 3 / SP: 4,243 of 768,000 / 0.6% level2 Motion Prediction / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Rapid Firing / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Sharpshooter / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level4 Small Energy Turret / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level4 Small Projectile Turret / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level1 Weapon Upgrades / Rank 2 / SP: 500 of 512,000 / 0.1% •9 Gunnery skills trained, for a total of 149,495 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Industry level4 Industry / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level2 Mass Production / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level4 Mining / Rank 1 / SP: 149,929 of 256,000 / 58.6% ·Currently training to: Level 5 ·SP done: 149,929 of 256,000 (58.6 %) ·Started: about 10 hours ago (02:55 am / 28th of Oct) ·Ending: about 23 hours from now (11:39 am / 29th of Oct) ·Time left: 1 Days, 0 Hours, 5 Minutes and 26 Seconds level2 Mining Upgrades / Rank 4 / SP: 5,657 of 1,024,000 / 0.6% level4 Refining / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level3 Scordite Processing / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level3 Veldspar Processing / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% •7 Industry skills trained, for a total of 264,925 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Leadership level3 Leadership / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level2 Mining Foreman / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% •2 Leadership skills trained, for a total of 10,829 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Learning level4 Analytical Mind / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level4 Empathy / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level4 Instant Recall / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level3 Iron Will / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level4 Learning / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level3 Logic / Rank 3 / SP: 24,000 of 768,000 / 3.1% level3 Spatial Awareness / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% •7 Learning skills trained, for a total of 221,020 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Mechanic level3 Hull Upgrades / Rank 2 / SP: 30,491 of 512,000 / 6.0% level2 Jury Rigging / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level4 Mechanic / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level4 Repair Systems / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% •4 Mechanic skills trained, for a total of 123,830 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Missile Launcher Operation level2 FoF Missiles / Rank 3 / SP: 4,243 of 768,000 / 0.6% level2 Missile Bombardment / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level3 Missile Launcher Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% level2 Rapid Launch / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Rockets / Rank 1 / SP: 1,415 of 256,000 / 0.6% level2 Standard Missiles / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level2 Target Navigation Prediction / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% •7 Missile Launcher Operation skills trained, for a total of 24,974 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Navigation level1 Acceleration Control / Rank 4 / SP: 1,000 of 1,024,000 / 0.1% level4 Afterburner / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level1 Evasive Maneuvering / Rank 2 / SP: 500 of 512,000 / 0.1% level2 Fuel Conservation / Rank 2 / SP: 2,829 of 512,000 / 0.6% level1 High Speed Maneuvering / Rank 5 / SP: 1,250 of 1,280,000 / 0.1% level4 Navigation / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% level2 Warp Drive Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 1,415 of 256,000 / 0.6% •7 Navigation skills trained, for a total of 97,504 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Science level3 Astrogeology / Rank 3 / SP: 24,000 of 768,000 / 3.1% level1 Cybernetics / Rank 3 / SP: 750 of 768,000 / 0.1% level0 Laboratory Operation / Rank 1 / SP: 0 of 256,000 / 0.0% level0 Research / Rank 1 / SP: 0 of 256,000 / 0.0% level4 Science / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% •5 Science skills trained, for a total of 70,005 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Social level1 Social / Rank 1 / SP: 250 of 256,000 / 0.1% •1 Social skills trained, for a total of 250 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Spaceship Command level3 Minmatar Frigate / Rank 2 / SP: 16,000 of 512,000 / 3.1% level3 Minmatar Industrial / Rank 4 / SP: 32,000 of 1,024,000 / 3.1% level3 Spaceship Command / Rank 1 / SP: 8,000 of 256,000 / 3.1% •3 Spaceship Command skills trained, for a total of 56,000 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Trade level4 Trade / Rank 1 / SP: 45,255 of 256,000 / 17.7% •1 Trade skills trained, for a total of 45,255 skillpoints. •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints. Total: •0 skills trained to level 5 for a total of 0 skillpoints which makes up 0.0% of your total SPs. •74 skills trained, of which 0.0% are level 5 skills. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:01 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ok just a couple of comments right now until I find out what your initial focas is going to be. (Mining, missioning, what are you going to do to make isk, right now?) Looking at your spaceship command skills, I am assuming Mining, but I want you to tell me that. I can't remember what level of cybernetics you need for plus 3 implants. It might be level 3 which you have right now. Your goal should be to get as many level 3 implants as possible. +3 Intelligence +3 Memory +3 Willpower +3 Perception. And get that learning skill trained to 5, its a rank1 so its pretty easy to train and it helps all the other learning skills. I wouldn't worry about charisma right now, The only thing it affects really in the whole tree is "Leadership, Trade, and Social. If you plan on mission running early you amay have to rethink that because Social affects all aspects of mission running, better standing, better rewards, etc. Then get the base learning skills you already have to at least 4. As you can afford them get the next tier of learning skills also trained to four. Training all your learning skills to level 4 both tiers, probably has a payback time of 8 to 9 months. The first tier to 5 and the second teir to 4 is 11 months. I know that for a fact. Both at 4 is an estimate. In other words, if you train all those skills to four, after 8 months or so, you will have made up the time you spent learning them, and after that all that extra spent time saved is gravy. So if you plan on playing EVE for the long haul its just best to get those skills trained and done with. Do you understand and are you using the "training que", being able to have several skills in "que" so they can automatically switch when you are offline? If so, and you need a long term skill to add to the end of the que so you will keep training, getting electronics to V, and engineering to V are real good skills to start working on as your final skill in the que. Thats about it for now. I kind of want to hear about your eve plans and then go from there with further advice. Ravage your an old timer at this stuff, am I missing anything? |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:09 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ravage wrote: even if you have no interest in joinging, send a message or start a conversation if you have any questions or want advice. name is Dark Umbra I'm willing to help get you up and running with whatever career path you have in mind, i'm quite well versed in pretty much everything from combat, to manufacturing, exploration, and ugh... even mining. ~Rav Hmmmm, maybe we should make an Avian Chat Channel? |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:10 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
we could... then next time i get the urge to make a Kronos, i can exploit any contact you may have for obtaining the exotic resources, rather than buying the rediculous amounts off the market like i did last time.... i think it was ferrogel that killed any chance of a decent profit margin. heh. You've covered all the basics i think Aranarth. like you, i can't really offer any advice until we find out the short and long term goals of his character. also, I'm much better at answering direct questions than speculative ones. things come back to me when i am asked about em. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:28 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ravage wrote: we could... then next time i get the urge to make a Kronos, i can exploit any contact you may have for obtaining the exotic resources, rather than buying the rediculous amounts off the market like i did last time.... i think it was ferrogel that killed any chance of a decent profit margin. heh. You've covered all the basics i think Aranarth. like you, i can't really offer any advice until we find out the short and long term goals of his character. also, I'm much better at answering direct questions than speculative ones. things come back to me when i am asked about em. Any exotic contacts I have are very sociailistic unfortunately. It all goes to the corp. One of my guys is back in Gallente Fac War for a while. Can you say "Ridiculously easy to obtain Navy Vexors, Domi's, and Megas?" About 12 hours (max) of easy missioning and already I have 160,000 LP's. (Thats Navy Dominix #1) Thats not working hard at all Kronos would be nice but a Navy Domi will do just fine. All I need is one. I plan on having at least one if not two more on Dec01. Can you say "gouge the price on the first day of release". |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:39 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Whats the Navy Domi going to be improved on over the Regular? Domi is my main mission ship, can do most level 4s solo. I played with a Navy Mega for a bit, but was less than impressed. Course i was less than impressed with the Kronos too... both likely due to the fact i have no compentency with any guns bigger than medium hybrids. I'm less than 2 days from my projected respec, (unless something else comes up i need to train first, but i don't think so at this point) i'll end up with Massive Perception/willpower, and if anything is left, will go into charisma. I've trained everything I want that uses Memory or Int, which are my primary attributes. Needless to say, this will be a year of massive beefing up of my combat abilities. Gunnery/Missiles/Spaceship Command mainly. For shits and giggles i'll post my EveMon skills here. |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 1:43 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Dark Umbra Attributes Intelligence: 27.50 Perception: 19.80 Charisma: 20.90 Willpower: 22.00 Memory: 31.90 Corporation Management Anchoring Corporation Management Ethnic Relations Total Skillpoints in Group: 903,765 Drones Amarr Drone Specialization Caldari Drone Specialization Combat Drone Operation Drone Durability Drone Interfacing Drone Navigation Drone Sharpshooting Drones Electronic Warfare Drone Interfacing Gallente Drone Specialization Heavy Drone Operation Mining Drone Operation Minmatar Drone Specialization Repair Drone Operation Scout Drone Operation Sentry Drone Interfacing Total Skillpoints in Group: 6,959,925 Electronics Cloaking Cynosural Field Theory Electronic Warfare Electronics Electronics Upgrades Frequency Modulation Long Distance Jamming Long Range Targeting Multitasking Projected Electronic Counter Measures Propulsion Jamming Sensor Linking Signal Dispersion Signal Suppression Signature Analysis Signature Focusing Survey Target Painting Targeting Turret Destabilization Weapon Disruption Total Skillpoints in Group: 5,742,044 Engineering EM Shield Compensation Energy Emission Systems Energy Grid Upgrades Energy Management Energy Pulse Weapons Energy Systems Operation Engineering Explosive Shield Compensation Kinetic Shield Compensation Shield Compensation Shield Emission Systems Shield Management Shield Operation Shield Upgrades Tactical Shield Manipulation Thermic Shield Compensation Total Skillpoints in Group: 5,497,570 Gunnery Advanced Weapon Upgrades Controlled Bursts Gunnery Large Hybrid Turret Medium Hybrid Turret Medium Railgun Specialization Motion Prediction Rapid Firing Sharpshooter Small Energy Turret Small Hybrid Turret Small Railgun Specialization Surgical Strike Trajectory Analysis Weapon Upgrades Total Skillpoints in Group: 4,673,845 Industry Arkonor Processing Bistot Processing Crokite Processing Dark Ochre Processing Gas Cloud Harvesting Gneiss Processing Hedbergite Processing Hemorphite Processing Ice Harvesting Industry Jaspet Processing Kernite Processing Mass Production Mining Mining Upgrades Omber Processing Plagioclase Processing Production Efficiency Pyroxeres Processing Refinery Efficiency Refining Scordite Processing Scrapmetal Processing Veldspar Processing Total Skillpoints in Group: 2,194,765 Leadership Armored Warfare Armored Warfare Specialist Information Warfare Leadership Mining Director Mining Foreman Siege Warfare Siege Warfare Specialist Skirmish Warfare Skirmish Warfare Specialist Warfare Link Specialist Wing Command Total Skillpoints in Group: 2,816,206 Learning Analytical Mind Clarity Eidetic Memory Empathy Focus Instant Recall Iron Will Learning Logic Presence Spatial Awareness Total Skillpoints in Group: 3,999,765 Mechanic Armor Rigging Astronautics Rigging Battleship Construction Cruiser Construction Drones Rigging EM Armor Compensation Electronic Superiority Rigging Energy Weapon Rigging Explosive Armor Compensation Frigate Construction Hull Upgrades Hybrid Weapon Rigging Industrial Construction Jury Rigging Kinetic Armor Compensation Launcher Rigging Mechanic Nanite Interfacing Nanite Operation Projectile Weapon Rigging Remote Armor Repair Systems Remote Hull Repair Systems Repair Systems Salvaging Shield Rigging Thermic Armor Compensation Total Skillpoints in Group: 2,541,414 Missile Launcher Operation Cruise Missiles Defender Missiles FoF Missiles Guided Missile Precision Heavy Assault Missiles Heavy Missiles Missile Bombardment Missile Launcher Operation Missile Projection Rapid Launch Rockets Standard Missiles Target Navigation Prediction Torpedoes Warhead Upgrades Total Skillpoints in Group: 305,500 Navigation Acceleration Control Afterburner Evasive Maneuvering Fuel Conservation High Speed Maneuvering Jump Drive Operation Navigation Warp Drive Operation Total Skillpoints in Group: 1,779,055 Science Amarrian Starship Engineering Astrogeology Astrometric Acquisition Astrometric Rangefinding Astrometrics Biology Cybernetics Electromagnetic Physics Electronic Engineering Gallente Encryption Methods Gallentean Starship Engineering Graviton Physics Hacking High Energy Physics Hydromagnetic Physics Infomorph Psychology Laboratory Operation Laser Physics Mechanical Engineering Metallurgy Minmatar Starship Engineering Molecular Engineering Nanite Engineering Plasma Physics Research Research Project Management Science Scientific Networking Thermodynamics Total Skillpoints in Group: 4,756,904 Social Bureaucratic Connections Connections Criminal Connections Diplomacy Fast Talk Military Connections Negotiation Political Connections Social Total Skillpoints in Group: 769,335 Spaceship Command Advanced Spaceship Command Amarr Battleship Amarr Cruiser Amarr Frigate Assault Ships Battlecruisers Caldari Frigate Command Ships Covert Ops Destroyers Electronic Attack Ships Gallente Battleship Gallente Cruiser Gallente Freighter Gallente Frigate Gallente Industrial Gallente Strategic Cruiser Heavy Assault Ships Interceptors Logistics Marauders Minmatar Frigate Recon Ships Spaceship Command Transport Ships Total Skillpoints in Group: 10,153,728 Subsystems Gallente Defensive Systems Gallente Electronic Systems Gallente Engineering Systems Gallente Offensive Systems Gallente Propulsion Systems Total Skillpoints in Group: 136,265 Trade Accounting Broker Relations Contracting Daytrading Marketing Procurement Retail Trade Total Skillpoints in Group: 443,607 Total Skillpoints: 53,673,693 Total Number of Skills: 245 Skills at Level 1: 65 Skills at Level 2: 5 Skills at Level 3: 16 Skills at Level 4: 88 Skills at Level 5: 69 |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 2:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Navy Mega changes: Quote: Megathron Navy Issue: • Fittings: 605 CPU, 16275 powergrid • Dronebay increased by 50m3, bandwidth unchanged • Speed: +5% max velocity and agility increased by 5% The big thing for me is the drone bay increase, now I can carry my T2 Sentries AND a full compliment of mediums or lights. As to your comment on T2 Heavy Hybrids. If you are gonna fly a Mega, get the T2 gun skills, the ship is really worthless without it. Named are OK, but having rails or blasters to V is a BIG help IMHO. Its still 600K LP's outside the militia but only 250K LP's from the FDU (Gallente militia corp) Navy Dominix, new and ONLY available with Federal Defense Union mission LP's (ie you have to do Fac War missions and get LPS for Fac War missions to get this ship or buy it on the market) Quote: Dominix Navy Issue: • Slot layout: 6 high, 6 med, 7 low slots, 6 turrets, no launchers • Fittings: 660 CPU, 9900 powergrid, 350 calibration, 3 rig slots • Hitpoints: +50% hit points on hull (9961), armor (9316) and shields (8203) • Capacitor: +5% max capacitor (5250 capacitor, 1087.5s recharge) • Dronebay increased by 25m3, bandwidth unchanged • Sensor: +25% magnetometric sensor strength I can pretty much with minimal management solo level IV's in a Domi right now. This ship will make them "no brainers". This is only 150K LP's a Hull and a Beta Nexus chip. My guess is this ship will sell like hotcakes in early Dcember. The Domi is argueably the favorite mission ship along with a CNR. (The Mauraders are up there as well but Im talking T1 here) So everybody and his uncle who flys Gallente to mission is going to want one. And only 3500 people are in the FDU right now. Low inventory, high demand. Its should be a sellers dream in early December. You are a bit ahead of me skillpoint wise, Im in the mid 40's somewhere. Lemme guess early 2006 toon? You got me beat in drones by a tad. I pwn your gun skills, your leadership skills are fairly impressive, way better than mine. The rest we are close. What do you have all the Amarr ships skills for and really no Amarr weapons sytems? |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:26 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Pilgrim. Nuff said. Best Covert Ops/Recon ship there is for a drone user. All its high slots are taken up by 2 energy neutralizers, 1 vampire, and the Covert Ops cloak.... so no need for Energy Weapons, and there's no bonuses for them anyway. the 50% bonus to drone hitpoints and damage, and can hold 3 flights of Medium drones. All i need is to survive long enough to drain the cap, (which with the ship's bonuses does not take long even for a battleship) then they're a sitting duck and the drones will peck away. Truely a brutal ship, one of my favourites. so yes, i trained Amarr Cruiser 5, just for that. Anyway, my drone skills are this way, because they're all i use for damage. my domi has 1 gun, a single light railgun for pulling. Sentries do the rest in most cases. My leadership skills are going to have a pretty decent boost right after the respec, everything will be 4 and 5 for the pre-reqs. After that, theres going to be some major boosting of gun and missile skills, and likely training all race's ships to 5... i've pretty much got every support skill for every race's specialties... (aside from gunnery types) so it shouldn't take much. As for the Navy Domi, We might need to work out something for you to sell me one then. most of my members are not interested in joining the faction war, as they don't want the possibility of being ambushed to present itself while missioning. From what i understand about the warfare process, you'd generally be safe in Gallente empire space, but i like the ability to travel where needed as well. I make regular runs all across the galaxy for Datacores with my 5 research agents heh. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Oh and one last thing Ryric, I have perfect refine skills for ore, loot, and ice at a 50% station (most of hi sec) at the right corps where I have standing. Assuming you are going to be a miner (its sort of looks that way from your early training) I can take a quick trip over there to refine for you lets say every two weeks or so. The key is its has t o be at an Expert Distribution Corp Station of a Sisters of EVE station in Minnie Space. I have close to 7.0 standing with the Minmatar but nothing high enough with any of there corps. I have standing with the two I mentioned, and I know they have stations in the Minmatar Sector. SOE is in Rens (That should be handy because its near the tutorial area.) Expert Distribution is all low sec in Heimatar. So if you want start stashing your ore in Rens. at SOE. Ill come by and melt it for ya. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:40 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ravage wrote: Pilgrim. Nuff said. Best Covert Ops/Recon ship there is for a drone user. All its high slots are taken up by 2 energy neutralizers, 1 vampire, and the Covert Ops cloak.... so no need for Energy Weapons, and there's no bonuses for them anyway. the 50% bonus to drone hitpoints and damage, and can hold 3 flights of Medium drones. All i need is to survive long enough to drain the cap, (which with the ship's bonuses does not take long even for a battleship) then they're a sitting duck and the drones will peck away. Truely a brutal ship, one of my favourites. so yes, i trained Amarr Cruiser 5, just for that. As for the Navy Domi, We might need to work out something for you to sell me one then. most of my members are not interested in joining the faction war, as they don't want the possibility of being ambushed to present itself while missioning. From what i understand about the warfare process, you'd generally be safe in Gallente empire space, but i like the ability to travel where needed as well. I make regular runs all across the galaxy for Datacores with my 5 research agents heh. Ah the Pilgrim, actually you didn't need to say anything after that If any of your guys has an alt (or a main for that matter) with high Caldari standing, doing the missions is a cinch in Fac War. Join as a group for two weeks. Jam out the missions. Get a Navy Domi on 01 Dec. Leave Fac war. There is this one mission where you have to grab an 80 cubes "dataheet" from a can in the second room. My Fac War guy and my Caldari High Standing alt group. Gal Mil guy is in a ceptor. My alt in a cov ops. I put a ghetto cloak in the highs of the ceptor. They both rendezvous in the target system. I hit warp, the ceptor stays put because its cloaked. the alt goes in. It doesn't get aggro because it has high Caldari standing. Quick scoops the mission item and then transfer it to the gal Mil guy. He ceptors back to the mission giver. The worst part is the warping its usually 10 jumps away in low sec. But in a ceptor its childs play. Rinse and repeat. Ive done close to or over 20 missions, and haven't been close to being caught, and have scooted right by Caldari fleets on numerous occassions One high Caldari standing alt can sit in Black Rise and cycle thru mission doers. I did that with my 18 year old the other night. The mission can also be speed tanked with some small armor repper in the lows action. My CEO did it a few times, but its close when you slow for the can. Or if you want, I can go ahead and gouge you for a Navy Domi as well |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:46 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
shame, none of them do have caldari faction. most of them are too noobish, and barely have gallente standings. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:48 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ravage wrote: shame, none of them do have caldari faction. most of them are too noobish, and barely have gallente standings. And I suppose you are the CEO right so a sabbatical would be awkward? |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
heh correct. mostly cause most of them are too scared to try shit on their own without me at least close by to swoop in and save the day. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 4:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Make em all train ceptor skills for the next month I was flying a damp Atron my second week in the game. And my first weekend in the game, after someone showed me how to do it, I ninja mined almost 8 million worth of Jaspet out of low sec over the course of a weekend in Navitas. Back when Jaspet was actually worth mining. Got popped and podded three times I wasn't even a week old. And thats when we started with a 200,000SP toon, before the accelerated learning today. I laugh now because that was small fortune back then. Now its a quick shopping trip in Dodixie. Kids these days they got it so easy I can save ya one but I won't cut much of a deal. Nothing personal but my Domi scam is going to fund my timecards for a good spell. Hell I made the 18 year join my Fac War corp. He kept saying, super dad you can get me a free Navy Domi. I just replied, "dream on bitch, you want a freebie ask mom for a free head rub" And thats my 18 year old, my first born. EVE is a cruel do or die world |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 4:33 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
i ain't asking for a handout. i've got no issues with spending isk... i bought a T3 cruiser and 2 sets of modules for the novelty of it... got sick of it after a week and resold and more than made back my money. Just don't be a douche about it, lol. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 4:47 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Ravage wrote: i ain't asking for a handout. i've got no issues with spending isk... i bought a T3 cruiser and 2 sets of modules for the novelty of it... got sick of it after a week and resold and more than made back my money. Just don't be a douche about it, lol. I am a cold hard bastard in game but Im fair. You start screwing around with folks and word gets around fast. How about we get in game on the first or second of December. We check contracts and agree to fair market value. I make the contract. It will probably be in Jufvitte, a couple jumps from Scolluzer the Verge Vendor Market hub (if you can actually call it a market hub, the market in Verge sucks) Its high sec, and you can go high sec back to Sinq or Essence. I think we should make an Avian Channel in game. |
Author: | Ravage [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 5:04 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Go for it, i'll prolly be late getting home, so post the channel name and pass here if you put one on. |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:52 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Initially I think I want to do some mining, currently working on getting to barges. That said I enjoy missions in my Rifter (min t1 frigate). I would like to be as balanced as possible in that respect ... Right now I am planning on getting to barges, working on my secondary skills (eng, elect etcl) the ones that will be useful no matter what ship I am flying. Hopefully while working on my cash flow mining. Then I would like to start working toward crusiers and other military minded things. Have to figure out where learning skills are going to fit into that longer term plan. Is their any reason to rush to exhumers? I feel like in high sec where I will be spending most of my time for now it would be a bit overkill. Planning on aiming for the retrev (think the cov req. Barges V/AstroV aka 60+ days of training according to evemon?). Am I being silly here, should I be beelining for a BC or BS and use it as a multi-purpose vessel? Feel like I may be a bit noob for those ships even if im 10 days out according from evemon b/c that doesnt include secondary skills |
Author: | Aranarth [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 11:22 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Okk if you are going to mine read this. Its by far the most comprehensive guide to mining you will ever find. Halada is a legend in Industrial circles because of this guide. 90% of what I learned about mining, I learned from this guide. No sh1t. http://www.lsjv-eve.com/completeminersg ... e_v3-0.pdf In essence, you can mine a lot of ore in a retriever, and for the money, and for the training time invested, it really can't be beat. A Dominix (Gallente Battleship) set up as a miner will equal it, but with the smaller cargo bay and the one minute laser cycle vice a three minute cycle for strip miners (Lasers go on non barges, strip miners go on barges and exhumers) will quickly drive you batshit. I did a ton of mining in a Dominer, (Dominix set up as a mining ship), and once I trained Hulks I never went back because of the longer cycle and the bigger cargo bay. How do the learning skills fit in? Each level of that learning skill bumps up that attribute. So train both of the intelligence granting skills to 4 each and you get a 8 point bump in your intelligence. Add the level 3 implants and you have an 11 point bump up. You train all those to four and pop in implants you'll probably cut Covetor and exhumer training in half, 30 instead of 60 days. Thats the power of learning skills. But again its about an 8 month payback. if you play longer than 8 months its paid for itself in accelerated training times. Level 1's suck and level 2's aren't much better. To do level 2's, you'll need a cruiser so dont put that off too long. Ill get my kid to help you with Minnie ships, he is a sunglass wearer The rifter is argueably the best T1 frigate in the game. And the Hurricane is a kick as battle cruiser. I do know that. But the cruisers Im not quite as clear about. Ill get some input from him. Are you close to Rens? If so stockpile your ore there at the SOE station. Ill melt it got you ocaasionally, at no loss. I have a perfect refine at SOE. Do that entire arc of noobie missions you get some decent rewards, some good basic standings with Minnie corps, and some decent T1 frigs. Its well worth it. Thats about it I launched "Avian Chat 2" join the channel its open. |
Author: | Dragon Fire [ Wed Oct 28, 2009 11:55 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Aranarth wrote: Okk if you are going to mine read this. Its by far the most comprehensive guide to mining you will ever find. Halada is a legend in Industrial circles because of this guide. 90% of what I learned about mining, I learned from this guide. No sh1t. http://www.lsjv-eve.com/completeminersg ... e_v3-0.pdf In essence, you can mine a lot of ore in a retriever, and for the money, and for the training time invested, it really can't be beat. A Dominix (Gallente Battleship) set up as a miner will equal it, but with the smaller cargo bay and the one minute laser cycle vice a three minute cycle for strip miners (Lasers go on non barges, strip miners go on barges and exhumers) will quickly drive you batshit. I did a ton of mining in a Dominer, (Dominix set up as a mining ship), and once I trained Hulks I never went back because of the longer cycle and the bigger cargo bay. How do the learning skills fit in? Each level of that learning skill bumps up that attribute. So train both of the intelligence granting skills to 4 each and you get a 8 point bump in your intelligence. Add the level 3 implants and you have an 11 point bump up. You train all those to four and pop in implants you'll probably cut Covetor and exhumer training in half, 30 instead of 60 days. Thats the power of learning skills. But again its about an 8 month payback. if you play longer than 8 months its paid for itself in accelerated training times. Level 1's suck and level 2's aren't much better. To do level 2's, you'll need a cruiser so dont put that off too long. Ill get my kid to help you with Minnie ships, he is a sunglass wearer The rifter is argueably the best T1 frigate in the game. And the Hurricane is a kick as battle cruiser. I do know that. But the cruisers Im not quite as clear about. Ill get some input from him. Are you close to Rens? If so stockpile your ore there at the SOE station. Ill melt it got you ocaasionally, at no loss. I have a perfect refine at SOE. Do that entire arc of noobie missions you get some decent rewards, some good basic standings with Minnie corps, and some decent T1 frigs. Its well worth it. Thats about it I launched "Avian Chat 2" join the channel its open. I've read that off the wiki (not sure if its different)...I'll take another look tomorrow. I've done the Military and Industrial Tutorial/starter career missions. I'm around the Ren's area, still at the starter station but have not established a more perm base of operations atm. This I have to talk over with some RL friends im playing with and see, either looking into an established corp or possibly joining Ravage in gallente... not sure. heading to bed, I probably won't be on much tomorrow night. |
Author: | Aranarth [ Thu Oct 29, 2009 8:59 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
Dragon Fire wrote: . I've read that off the wiki (not sure if its different)...I'll take another look tomorrow. I've done the Military and Industrial Tutorial/starter career missions. I'm around the Ren's area, still at the starter station but have not established a more perm base of operations atm. This I have to talk over with some RL friends im playing with and see, either looking into an established corp or possibly joining Ravage in gallente... not sure. heading to bed, I probably won't be on much tomorrow night. All I am saying is if you are mining, save your ore. Ill run over a couple times a month and melt it for you. You will get a LOT more ISK selling the mins then just selling ore, and once melted its smaller to carry. Also don't bother melting your own at your skill level you'll make more selling ore. If you move from Rens Area next week so be it. If you move to gallente Space thats even better for me I have many more corps with standing in Gallente space where I have a perfect refine. The bottomline is it will make you a lot more ISK. I can quickly pop over in an interceptor. It wont take that long. I just can't do it every single day I spent MONTHS training all those skills, if I can use em to help out a group of n00bs, and it helps keep them in the game, well then Ive done my Boy Scout Good Deed for the day |
Author: | Ravage [ Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:45 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
I have perfect ore and loot refining at every 50% Gallente station, (pretty much every one in high sec) so i'm able to help in that regards as well. If you end up coming to Sinq Laison and joining me, as i said way up in the thread, missions won't be a problem, Level 1 agent 2 jumps from my system, levels 2 and 3 in my station, level 4s 5 jumps away. so you'll be set in that regards pretty much for as long as you want to stick around. i kinda went an odd route i think when i first started playing... i worked and got myself a battleship as soon as i could, knowing full well i'd barely have the other skills required to fly it. as i recall, i couldn't even fit a large armor repairer 1. but the fact i was in a battleship doing level 2 and 3 missions, it didn't matter. was basically relying on the hitpoints i had to get me through, and it worked well. Once i started getting the support skills up, electronics, engineering, mechanic, and navigation... i really noticed myself getting more powerful. taking less damage, far less "oh shit" moments... and it felt good. I don't know if this is the best way to go for a new player... its just the way i did it. I generally tell people to fly a frigate, get a cruiser then battlecruiser. work your way up. but there are definitely other options. come to think of it though, I had a huge advantage of not having to get gunnery skills that a minmatar pilot would need. I killed everything with drones, (and actually still do heh) so i don't know if my game plan would transfer well to your character. Probably the biggest thing you'd need for a while is a battlecruiser with medium guns... they don't take too long to become effective. |
Author: | Ravage [ Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:55 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Eve Status |
As for exhumers, you're correct, theres no point for an exhumer in high sec. the retriever, i'm pretty sure has a drone bay, which you can throw at least a few light drones in, which will more than be enough for protection mining in high sec. if you're going to be doing any serious amount of mining, keep in mind you'll also need some form of industrial. gallente have the biggest cargo capacity in that respect, but you can fly anyone you wish. (note: if you're flying minmatar combat ships, doesn't mean you have to fly minmatar industrials. you can mix and match as you see fit) |
Page 1 of 2 | All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ] |
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |